Star Trek: Strange New Worlds

[Jeff T]

I am adding/starting this thread separately from the Discovery/Picard thread even though some of those involved in Discovery and Picard are also involved in bringing Captain Pike, Science Officer Spock and Number One back to explore new worlds around the galaxy on the U.S.S. Enterprise in this spin-off series. Although anything related to Kurtsman and crew is suspect to me, and probably others, AND for GOOD reasons... having Pike on the show was about the only redeeming aspect of that hot mess of Discovery IMHO.

To those unfamiliar with this....Star Trek: Strange New Worlds is the upcoming TV series set in the 23rd century, probably about 5 years before the classic show. It was announced on May 15, 2020, in a video message from Ethan Peck, Anson Mount, and Rebecca Romijn. The cast repeatedly suggested this project came into being because fans wanted it. The show will take place in established Star Trek continuity (Prime Timeline), but during a period that has not been extensively depicted.

This video just released confirms that they will also go back to an episodic approach like TOS rather than the stretched out season long arcs. An actual smart decision for once! It also discusses uniforms being closer to the Pike era but somewhat modified.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUK7MMA4Gww

According to INVERSE, this is how they have mapped this timeline out: https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/star-trek-strange-new-worlds-release-date-trailer-cast-timeline

Strange New Worlds is both a sequel to Discovery Season 2 and a prequel to The Original Series. Presumably, the show will chronicle a five-year mission commanded by Captain Pike from roughly 2258-ish to 2263-ish.

For context, this is how it shakes out:

2150s-2160s Star Trek: Enterprise

Early 2254: Short Treks episode "Q&A"; Spock's first day on the Enterprise

2254: "The Cage"; first (initially) unaired 1965 Star Trek pilot (filmed in 1964). Also, the first (filmed) appearance of Spock, Pike, and Number One

2256-2258: Star Trek: Discovery Seasons 1 and 2

2258-2263(?) Star Trek: Strange New Worlds

2265-2270 Star Trek: The Original Series.

2270s-2290s Star Trek classic movies

2360s-2399: The Next Generation, Deep Space Nine, Voyager, TNG movies, Lower Decks, and Picard.

3188-?: Star Trek: Discovery Season 3 and Season 4.

"We're going to try to harken back to some classical Trek values, to be optimistic, and to be more episodic," Akiva Goldsman told Variety in May 2020. "Our plots will be more closed-ended than you’ve seen in either Discovery or Picard. I imagine it to be closer to the original series than even DS9. We can really tell closed-ended stories. We can find ourselves in episodes that are tonally of a piece."

I sometimes feel like Charlie Brown trusting Lucy not to pull the football away at the last moment resulting in falling on my ass once again, but there is a glimmer of hope that maybe... just maybe some lessons will have been learned by those running this series and they will strive to actually pay homage to the prime universe, Starfleet, the officers, the Enterprise, character driven stories, respect for diplomacy, etc... and FINALLY create a series worth watching and embracing.

Personally, I loved the original pilot The Cage with Jeffrey Hunter, Majel Barrett and Leonard Nimoy (+others) along with how it was first presented to us in The Menagerie with Shatner, Kelly, Doohan, etc... Maybe they will get writers that know and respect TOS & cannon along with presenting good, plausible science fiction stories. If so, this could have the potential to be something special. There may even be a Yeoman Colt who was featured in The Cage, among others from the pilot.

So... I know that skepticism will be ubiquitous, but is anyone else anticipating that this could be worth watching, the 10 - 15 first season episodes once released?

If possible, let's keep the discussion focused on this series alone in this thread and keep Picard, Discovery and other recent fiascos from filtering in.

[Kheren]

The one thing to say for this series is that, according to rumors, Kurtzman was removed from all creative influence on this; that it is Akiva Goldsman's baby. Even if the original script for it had Kurtzman involved, the rumor says that his input was removed from it and what is being filmed now is different from the original concept. It is also rumored that Emma Watts is attached to this and she is firmly against Kurtzmantrek.

That being said, it's still Secret Hideout and it's still alternate licence and therefore still under Kurtzman and Abrams' power. My expectations and hopes can not be lower. Recall that Goldsman was involved in the precedent fiascos; most of all the asinine finale of STP and the awful pilot of STD. Also, what we got of Pike (yes my goddess Burnham), Spock (singing and dislexic) and Number One (singing and emotional) so far was pretty bad.

Unless they firmly move away from what had come before, their promises are just like what they promised since Abrams movie in 2009. And we saw what they were worth.

I sincerely hope I'm completely wrong about this, as I hoped when STD and STP came out. But consider this; since Kurtzman took over, anyone professing knowledge or love for Star Trek has been systematically rejected when applying for any job relating to it. Kurtzman himself stated last year that he has no interest in doing Star Trek but only in using it as a socio-political platform. And it is for this upcoming series that they came up with the idea of a bisexual Captain Kirk...

If proven wrong in my misgivings, truly I will be the first one to dance with joy. But forgive me if I have not taken out my dancing shoes yet.

Let's wait and see then. Nothing else we can do until the premiere.

[Kheren]

Latest rumors - I repeat, rumors - about the current State of Trek:


- Situation with Star Trek at ViacomCBS/Paramount is described as '' chaotic'' on all fronts. Financing, writing, filming, distribution, all allegedly a mess.

- Strange New Worlds will be only 8 episodes, half of them currently being rewritten in earnest already by Akiva Godsman as preliminary estimates of what has been produced has been called, let' s say, highly unsatisfactory; more clearly, it was called  ''full Abramstrek'' and  ''STD all over again.''

- Strange New Worlds, Discovery season 4, Picard season 2, Lower Decks season 2 and Prodigy are now all entirely financed by ViacomCBS/Paramount; which are currently in dire financial straights with no better days in sight.

- All investors, licencees, distributors have walked out on all of bad Robot/Secret Hideout Trek projects.

- There is still no Section 31 show in the works, nor Star Trek IV or any of the promised projects over the years.

- There is no Star Trek movie discussed, planned, greenlighted or else at Paramount. The latest announcement of an upcoming Trek movie was solely out of Bad Robot merely as a salespitch to attract investors. So far, not one answered the call.

- Furthermore, Paramount allegedly stated that there will be no more Star Trek movie made under Bad Robot, period.


This may all sound dark, gloomy and disappointing; except that it would mean this bad Mirror Universe Kurtzmantrek might be coming to a close, even with the insanely iron clad contract Kurtzman and co seems to have. That darkness might simply be because we are out too far from the campfire.

[Sorripto]

Kheren is right. Several inside sources are reporting that new Star Trek has not only not been a success, but has caused massive underreported financial losses. Merchandising, investors, distributors and even syndication contracts are all non existent or incredibly lowball offers. It appears that Discovery, Picard and others were pushed through more out of spite and stubbornness than out of anything which studio heads thought would make serious money. One article I read noted that even small budget productions have outside advertisers, investors and merchandisers working with the studio and CBS/Paramount has none for their current Star Trek products. This shows that those who actually see the money, or know the inside scoops, are staying as far away from this franchise as possible. Interestingly enough old trek recently expanded in several of those areas with new deals and expanded merchandise.

[Kheren]

One thing is clear so far; just as for all the rest of Kurtzmantrek that came before, nothing positive or encouraging at all is coming out of the rumor mill. In fact, it is the exact same thing once again like every time before, if not worse.

For me, the only thing I'm looking forward to is the final release of Axanar later this year; and some possible good fanfilm. Anything ''official Trek'' is currently DOA... unless some major, unforeseen happenstance occurs, like Viacomcbs selling the IP (which would oust Kurtzman and Abrams and their contract if the buyer makes it part of the deal, like Disney bought Fox but not Fox News.)

We're not out of the Badlands yet.

[Redding]

I still maintain my boycott of all current things Star Trek.
I haven't seen a single episode of STD, STP or STLD (With the exception of a few clips here and there)
I will not be watching Pike either unless someone here says it's worth it to do so.
You are the only people I still trust.
Entertainment wise its been a blight of a decade for me.
The only relief being the Mandalorian and The Captain America spin off.. and That's starting to go bad as well, I may not follow the second season.
Also the cartoon 'Invincible' is pretty good as well as 'The Bad Batch'
Tasty little bread crumbs to a starving man.

[Kheren]

Again according to reports and rumors, Star Wars at least is about to be saved. Lots of positive things coming out from over there. Mandalorian has kept the battered franchise afloat and now it seems the Kennedy dark times are soon to be over.

Now if Star Trek could be so lucky...

Good for you to not waste time with Kurtzmantrek. beleive me you missed nothing and saved your time for something worthwhile instead of crap. Wise choice.

Indeed it's been an awful decade for entertainment but some good things are now coming out. Invincible, Godzilla vs Kong, Superman & Lois, the Favreauverse... But there are still a few duds left like Falcon & Winter Soldier going down full w0ke, the atrocious Batwoman... and Kurtzmantrek still hijacking Star Trek.

Let's take heart. The recent oscars abysmal failure, the dire financial straights of studios and the downfall of US comics vs massive success of manga, might finally trigger a revival of good, honest, quality entertainment.

[Jeff T]

Warning: spoilers included!

Well… despite my many reservations, I just watched the premiere of Strange New Worlds. Does it compare to TOS? Not in my opinion, but this premiere episode was more on par with the ideals of Star Trek than Discovery or Picard. However, there was a bit too much not so subtle nodding to Trekisms… kind of like see… we are real Trek than was needed. They need to learn subtly rather than things being overt. Maybe that will occur over time. Blatant example: Spock and T-Pring… ugh.

What bothered me a bit more was having the technology seeming so advance for another prequel. I understand the temptation to utilize all the new technology and such available, but they could study examples like Star Trek Continues, then take note on how to resist the temptation to over modernize the series. The real heart of Star Trek is found within the deep character studies and thought-provoking story telling within individual episodes. Technology should be in the background for the most part and used sparingly like a collection of spices in a delicious meal. It can either enhance the flavoring or overpower it.

To my perspective, Anson Mount was one of the very rare and tolerable aspects that appeared in Discovery. The character of Pike was much more balanced as a representative of Star Fleet than the surrounding mess of Discovery, which I stopped watching after the 2nd season.

It seems in this first episode that they are at least striving to get away from the blatant dystopian dark and gritty season-long soap operas and return to the episodic format that embraces elements of hope even in dire circumstances. The challenge will be to do this without being too preachy and allow insights into the characters to develop slowly… through different episodes.

There were certainly obvious tie-ins to the continuing civil unrest currently occurring in the US and other countries in this episode and used as a warning to this other planet in the midst of their dangerously escalating conflict.  Again, this is not unusual for Star Trek… but it is a fine line not to tip this into something too moralistic or self-righteous. Great writing can do this brilliantly, however. Hopefully, the stories will be well-crafted.

I also hope that they also don’t overkill the known fate of Pike, which he had “seen” in Discovery. It appeared multiple times in this episode and was a centerpiece to his coming to terms with recent events, leading to his somewhat cliché I don’t want command of the ship at the beginning. I understand that it was used for him to come to terms with his reservations and I hope that now that this has been CLEARLY established, they can leave it behind in future episodes. Otherwise, it’s too much of a nod to TOS The Menagerie’s version of Pike, and repeating it eventually transitions into a dumbing down of the significance of that fate and his dilemma for the audience.

I am not addressing every aspect of the episode here… just what came to mind after watching it.

Will I see the upcoming episodes? I am not certain. I made the mistake of subscribing before and I am quite ambivalent of doing so again.

Anyone else see this show? What are your thoughts on the first episode?

[Kheren]

I have the chance of being in Canada and here the show is on mainstream TV. If you want to call this chance...

yeah, SPOILERS ALERT! SPOILERS ALERT! SPOILERS ALERT! SPOILERS ALERT!SPOILERS ALERT! SPOILERS ALERT! SPOILERS ALERT! SPOILERS ALERT!

I quite agree with you; mostly. Personally, the ''modernization'' does not bother me at all. They are also fighting very very hard not to get back to their trademark sublighting and lense flares so the look is more alive, bright and inviting instead of forcibly overdramatic with every shot. The music is adequate, the effects beautiful and Anson Mount carries it all on his shoulders; quite well to be honest. A few new, original characters seem interesting (thinking of engineer Hemmer here. Pilot Ortega, ugh)

Now what matters the most; cinematography, storytelling and characters. Succintly put, so far after 2 episodes, it is STD 2.0 with a forced positive spin at the end to make it superficially feel ''more Trek.''

But Star Trek is not ''they lived happily ever after.'' It's science speculation in an entertaining way; science-fiction. But not this. We are still served 1930 serials comic book science (retroengineering from telescopes), technobabble turned into pure nonsense (''warp'' bomb) and no effort whatsoever at any originality (ep 02 is Close Encounter Of The Third Kind, TOS The Paradise Syndrome and For The World Is Hollow And I have Touched The Sky mashed together).

This is not Strange New Worlds; this is Boring Old Worlds.

Also they are down again in full revisionist mode. Vulcans are now mere Space Elves with not a hint of what they were before. Gorns are now monsters from Alien and we know the Tholians are coming before their time. And they can't stop talking about STD; even if they were to ''never talk about this again,'' remember? Well they even have a shuttle now named after the engineer of the mushroom drive...

Almost all the main crew is pilfered from TOS; and beyond the absurdity of each one being there, let alone ALL of them, they are unrecognizable. Kyle is now Asian, M'Benga looks and sound like a drug dealer more than a doctor, Chapel is now a sadistic hottie, Uhura is turned into Hoshi Sato, Number One lost all of her stoicism and professional composure, Spock is his laughing, emo self of Short Treks... and every character is going to have a tragic (and cliche) traumatic backstory, complete with further canon violations. Their behavior is also too often annoyingly unprofessional; another Kurtzmantrek trope.

Not to mention how they botched the whole Pike ''destiny'' theme that could have been intriguing. Since he says he now knows about his death, then he knows it will not be while serving on the Enterprise. So why is he reluctant to command the Enterprise? As always, melodrama-formula Kurtzmantrek that makes no sense.

And the dialogs; those are the worst. It goes from their trademark anachronistic 21st century US slang (''cool'') to trying to be the Orville (corridors...) and, of course, vapid, insignificant pompous proclamations thinking they are profound and brilliant (''Our first journey to the stars is science-fiction, until one day, it isn't'') I've read better in Chinese Fortune Cookies.

Filmaking is lavish but with the usual Abramsverse failings, notably with pacing and time, like people suddenly in different places with different clothes without any sense of time accounting for it. It makes the experience jarring, jerky, incoherent; not helpful when the storytelling is weak as it is. it still feels like amateurs are in charge; or lazy, careless people.

Now, the episodic formula is way more forgiving than their always failed seasonal arc. And these are very short seasons compared to Classic Trek so they can adjust quickly. It is said that it gets truly good after ep 05. So, 3 more Kurtzmancrap ones to go.

It better be... but it is said hope is not a strategy...

[Kheren]

Well, great news!

No, not because SNW's first season has ended. Overall, it was the best of Kurtzmantrek; even if it was a pretty low bar to begin with and did not hover much over it. Lots of ripping off, pilfering, disfiguring, bad amateurish first-draft writing and uninspired stories ranging from below the worst of Trek to just under average Trek.

The good news is how it ended; confirming once and for all with s1 e10 that Kurtmantrek, especially SNW and DIS, as being firmly established in the Kelvin Universe, NOT in Classic Trek of TOS, TNG, VOY, DS9 and ENT (and movies from STTMP to Nemesis).

Case in point;

- Beyond the starwarshy visuals, a staple of Abramstrek and Kurtzmantrek, the USS Farragut is shown as an Abrams design instead of the Constitution class it was assumed to be for the last 50+ years.


- Captain Kirk described and portrayed as Chris Pine's Kirk (impulsive, insubordinate, anti-Starfleet) NOT Bill Shatner's Kirk (disciplined, steadfast, Starfleet through and through).


- Most signifiant of all, the final conversation between Kirk and Pike, where Kirk states he was raised in Iowa and his father serving on the USS Kelvin; in Classic Trek, Kirk explicitely stated (ST IV The Voyage Home) that he WAS FROM Iowa, NOT from outer space (as in ST 09). Furthermore, the USS Kelvin is exclusively of the Abramsverse (hence his parallel universe NAMED after THIS specific ship nowhere to be even hinted at before that movie).


There you have it; with their regular recalls to DIS in SNW and their insistence Kurtzmantrek being in the Prime Universe (which is Abrams' version of the Classic Universe from which his Kelvin Universe sprang with it's own non-Trek temporal laws) it is now canonized. It's all Abrams/Kurtzman's universe. Not Roddenberry's universe.

So now they can have their Klingorcs and Gorn xenomorphs, their TOS crew 10 years before their time and emo-Spock, their space elves and all female galactic leaders, their magical mushroom drives and time crystals, their space sonars and blasters, their future dystopian grimdark universe, forget about transporters, universal translators and shields. It's THEIR thing they call Star Trek.

No more canon violations; because it is apart from TOS, TNG, VOY, DS9 and ENT. We can accept or reject it as it's own thing, inspired by Star Trek only, just like The Orville is (without usurping name and looks in the latter case).