Starship Smackdown!

[BLZBUB]

 Although I really admired the design concept with the introduction of the D'Kora in ST:TNG, it really doesn't have the shield or hull strength to stand up to the Nebula.

 If the Ferengi can get the upper hand off the git-go, they stand a chance, but otherwise ... Fed takes the match.
 
 I vote Nebula.

[Storm Windfall]

 Although I really admired the design concept with the introduction of the D'Kora in ST:TNG, it really doesn't have the shield or hull strength to stand up to the Nebula.

 If the Ferengi can get the upper hand off the git-go, they stand a chance, but otherwise ... Fed takes the match.
 
 I vote Nebula.

What he said...  

[Sorripto]

I too had to go with the Nebula. Although my bias stems from it being one of my favorite ship designs, so there is that. However from a technical standpoint the advancements in both armorments and defense would be too much for the D'Kora.

[Evshell]

Usually I wait until days later to reply, but since it is already 3-0 in favor of the Nebula, I'm going to have to put my 2 cents in early to try to even the score!

As I've stated before this doesn't have to be about pure firepower, otherwise the end result is known: Borg Cube.

In this case the capabilities of each ship is so close that even if you did compare based on only firepower, it would be a very close fight. When you combine that with the fact that in, my opinion, the D'Kora is definitely in the top 10 most ingenious and original ship designs, I'll have to go with the D'Kora.

The Nebula is just a smaller Galaxy. It does not have much originality of design other than an ugly (again, just my opinion) triangle sticking out the top. The D'Kora just screams Ferengi, with its copper-gold color representing money and the curves and sharp points that so well represent their nature... smooth and pleasantly inviting, but with a few sharp points where money is concerned.

[Battle Lion]

I'm not sure why you guys are saying the nebula (a science ship) can out gun a d'kora....when we first saw the d'kora, worf evaluted its defensive capabilities to be basiclly ON PAR with the galaxy class.

the nebula is seen taking out some cardassian ships without much trouble, but we dont really know what class those ships were. they could have easily been hidekis. 

[Kheren]

First the nebula is not a science ship; it is a multipurpose platform where the upward pod is useable and replaceable as anything from cargo space to shuttle hangar (be it exploration, delivery of goods, colony transport or evacuation, or fighter squadrons), huge hospital bay, research lab or torpedo launcher batteries, whatever you can imagine. It is a premium multipurpose design fielded by Starfleet from the highly sophisticated and proficient Galaxy class design; no wonder it could be made a warship like the USS Phoenix capable of facing several Cardassian cruisers alone.

Second, to me, mere firepower and tactical capabilities alone are not the sole or best issue with this smackdown; it is about our preferences and why we do have those preferences. As Evshell puts it, a mere tactical face off is dull and pointless since the only final result can only be the Borg Cube. This would make all this game utterly boring to me.

That being said, although I do not think the Nebula design very estheatically pleasing (although more than the ... Defiant!!!), it is nevertheless a good, beleivable continuity of starship design that make more sense to me than the myriad of starships that had popped up like car models all accross the board in the later years (The infamous Frankenstein Fleet of DS9 where they cannibalized a flurry of models to come up with meaningless monstrosities like the Yeager class). So I do like it... but I'm voting D'Kora.

Again as Evshell puts it, it is original, distinctive, powerful and closely identifies itself with the alien culture it protrays. I recall how mysterious and fascinating it proved itself to be when it first appeared in TNG. Just like the Tholian ship, it is a striking and unique design that deserve to be recognized as such.

[Athos]

First the nebula is not a science ship; it is a multipurpose platform...

I could not have said it better.  The Nebula class was actually originally designed as a warp sled to be able to go out and pick up the saucer sections of Galaxy Class starships that have separated.  Obviously, it's a solid starship on its own.  The most notable feature of the Nebula class is the interchangable equipment module that sits above the primary hull.  This module typically carried an advanced array of sensor equipment and torpedo tubes.  There is absolutely nothing (in canon or in interviews with the designers of the ship) to support that the equipment pod could be used as a hanger bay or cargo pod. 

The defensive systems on the Nebula class are roughly equivalent to the Galaxy class, so I'm not certain why anyone would doubt the ability for this class to take on a Ferengi D'Kora.  In fact, the Nebula class was quite the battleship during the Dominion War.  The USS T'Kumbra spent 6 months fighting on the front lines during the Dominion War; if the nebula class was not a solid ship, it would not have survived.  We also see numerous other nebula-class ships in fleet formations during battle scenes.

Finally, the Nebula class, like the Galaxy, was continually upgraded and improved.  For example, in 2368, the top speed was warp 9.3; by 2370, it was warp 9.5.  Chief O'Brien was even able to eeek warp 9.6 out of the USS Prometheus for a short time.  It's basically a modern take on the Miranda class.


The D'Kora class is a beautiful and original design.  Originally, the Ferengi were intended to be the arch-enemy of the Federation in the 24th century like the Klingon Empire was in the 23rd.  That obviously did not happen as we saw the Ferengi move from being 'tough' to being more of a nuisance and comical relief.  Likewise, their ships went from being almost on par with a Galaxy Class to be weak; nothing more than freighters.  In fact, after the second season of TNG, we never see a Ferengi ship even fire a weapon.  While I like the design, the ship just does not impress me.  For the final battle of DS9 (re-taking Cardassia), I really thought that with Rom as the Grand Nagus, we would have seen a fleet of D'Kora class ships come to the aid of the allied fleet.  But we didn't...because they are just pretty freighters. 

My vote...Nebula Class

[Kheren]

  There is absolutely nothing (in canon or in interviews with the designers of the ship) to support that the equipment pod could be used as a hanger bay or cargo pod.

I beg to differ.

First; the ACTD website does very detailed and well made work referring to all the relevant official technical manuals and come up with this:

"APPENDIX A - AVAILABLE POD MODULES   

The Nebula-class is unique in that it has a large interchangeable equipment module located at the rear of the ship. The ‘pod’ as it is sometimes called, can be replaced with another - sometimes within a few days - when performed at a starbase. Changing pods is a very involved process, and frequent module changes can cause undue stress on the ship. As such, procedure dictates that the ship must not change modules more often than every 6 months without due reason. Such reasons could include damage to the previous module, special missions from Starfleet, or testing new equipment.

The original Nebula-class vessels utilized an elliptical module, which was connected to the engineering section by two reinforced struts. Revisions to the structure later changed the connecting pylon to a singular connection strut. This revision also included a new module design, in the form of a triangular module. This design officially replaced the elliptical module in 2370, and ships are being upgraded as time and resources allow. Completion of the upgrade is expected fleet-wide by 2380.There are several different pods available, some of which are outlined below.

Sensor pod: The majority of the first Nebula-class ships were outfitted with this pod, which greatly extended the ship’s sensor range. With this pod the Nebula-class ship is virtually unmatched in regards to sensor capability. Ships with this pod module were routinely assigned to deep-space exploration, hostile border patrols or long-range reconnaissance.

Weapons pod: With the recent Borg invasions and Dominion War, Starfleet quickly mobilized to deploy the weapons pod, which contains 8 forward-facing torpedo launchers, and 3 Type X point-defense phaser emitters. The launchers are fed by an additional 200 photon torpedoes stored in the pod itself. While equipped with eight launchers, each launcher is a smaller type similar to that used by Intrepid-class ships, and as such can only fire up to 3 torpedoes at once, with a reload time of 6 seconds. Later versions of the pod are also equipped with a limited number of quantum torpedoes. The weapons pod is also equipped with two shield generators (one main, one backup), since it was realized that the pod would be an easy target. The shield generators are the same type used through-out the rest of the ship, and draw power directly from the auxiliary energy reserves during Red Alert situations.

Tactical pod: This is a recent addition to the Nebula-class fleet, and is quickly becoming the default module for all new Nebulas being built. The design combines the scanning capabilities of the sensor pod and the offensive capabilities of the weapons pod into one module. There are disadvantages to this design. The tactical pod contains 75 less torpedoes (125), in order to make room for the sensor pallets. Also, the scanners are primarily designed to aid in targeting for the torpedoes and phasers, and as such are not optimized for long-range usage.

Hospital pod: This specialty pod, while not found in wide-spread use, includes the same medical facilities found in large starbases and is equipped to handle several hundred casualties at once.

Habitation/Colony pod: This pod contains a large number of residential quarters, and is sometimes used on long-term missions, or on missions focusing on populating a colony. Depending on configuration, up to 6,000 people can be ferried in the habitation module. With slight modifications, this module can be configured to act as a troop transport, enabling the ship to carry several thousand troops. During the offensive on Cardassia Prime at the end of the Dominion War, several habitation pod-equipped ships were used with great efficacy to transport Marines to the front lines. This module also contains a dozen dedicated transporters, allowing the roughly 5,000 troops to be beamed out within a relatively short amount of time.

Shuttlebay/Hangar pod: This experimental pod includes a large shuttle hangar with the space to hold over two dozen runabouts and fighters. Further information regarding maximum capacity and capabilities is classified pending review by Starfleet Command.Skid pod: This pod, while rarely used, can be used to tow a smaller ship at high warp for extended distances. The pod consists of two elongated pylons, which are then connected to another ship with reinforced bolts. By not using tractor beams, the Nebula-class ship is able to divert more power to the structural integrity field, and thus travel at a higher velocity for a longer period of time.

Miniature Warp Nacelles: This type of pod is still considered experimental, and most likely will not be approved for fleet-wide use. The design features two nacelles, each approximately one-third scale, positioned directly above the main nacelles. While not giving the ship a higher warp speed, it does allow the ship to maintain high warp for a longer period of time. Given the amount of work that must be put into properly connecting the mini-nacelles, they are likely to remain in the experimental phase for some time. At this time, only four Nebula-class starships are equipped with this “module”.


Most Nebula-class ships are assigned two main modules (one sensor and one weapons module), though some ships are also given a specialty module (hospital/habitation/skid). Some ships are making the tactical pod their main module, since it combines the abilities of the two main pods. At this time, the Hangar Pod is found on only a select number of ships. In order to exchange pods, the ship must be docked at a certified facility for a minimum of two days, to give suitable time to perform diagnostics on all connections and systems. The exchange must be approved by both the ship’s captain and the station commander. An upgrade recently approved by Starfleet Command allows a Nebula-class ship to have ablative armor installed over critical points on the ship, mostly centered on the points connecting the pod-module to the ship itself. This upgrade is currently limited to ships serving on the out-skirts of the Federation border, or near hostile borders, due to limited resources.Many of the above modules contain habitable decks, and are referred to by letters; Deck A would be the top-most deck, deck B would be below it, and so on. Access to these decks is normally restricted, due to the sensitivity of the surrounding areas."



Second: even if you limit yourself to something like Memory Alpha or the TNG Technical manual to the exclusion of everything else, you get very succint but clear statements that the Nebula class is mounted with a module intended for various purposes. Even if for example  we never see on film an actual Nebula starship launching a fighter squadron, that does not mean that it can't; on the contrary, because of the very nature of the thing, there is no logical reason to assume that it could not. It doesn't have to be explicitely said.

As a matter of fact, the final scene in Generations may hint at the shown Nebula class bringing such a shuttlebay pod to evacuate the marroned crew of the Enterprise.

Regardless, the point was just made to show that the Nebula was a multipurpose ship, not just a science ship. If I was a Starfleet admiral in charge of planetary evacuation or rescue operations, I would certainly order Nebulas with transporter modules, shuttle modules and hospital/refugee modules to be made available.

[Athos]

Kheren...the ACTD website is NOT canon, nor is it endorsed by Paramount or CBS.  It might be a very detailed website based upon logical deductions given what was observed on screen or in official tech manuals, but that is beside the point.  I specifically stated "There is absolutely nothing (in canon or in interviews with the designers of the ship) to support that the equipment pod could be used as a hanger bay or cargo pod." 

I did not state that no one has hypothesized the use of the equipment pod as a hanger bay, cargo pod, research lab, etc.  In fact, I tend to agree that it COULD be used as such.  But, my original statement is correct and stands.

[Kheren]

I didn't say you were incorrect. I said I begged to differ... and stated why.